Meeting Minutes
Minutes of April 5, 2001
[Approved 4/19/01]
Present: Robert Boisselle, Paul Locke, William Dailey, Bruce Rider, David Valade
Granite & Burnett Street
Bob passed photographs around of Granite and Burnett Streets under water. About 85% of the lot is under water as indicated in the area. While Nancy was out visiting sites, she went to Slayton Road and you will also find pictures of that site. There is a lot of water in Slayton Road area.
David: I have a question just to make sure I am not mistaken. You said peat is something that historically over a long time builds up on the wetland, stuff that rots and lands under it?
Bob: That is correct.
David: The reason I am asking that is because we did have another statement that it never used to be wet until the city did some work, but: a) it is in a flood plain, and b) peat is built up which means it has been wet for hundreds, if not thousands of years.
Bob: People have come up to me and indicated that area has always been wet, going back 30-40 years.
David: Which is probably what I guessed. It is just like the neighbor said this has flooding, but everyone else said it always did.
Mt. Hood - 12th Tee
Bob: Our next set of pictures represents what is going on at Mt. Hood. This is lake 12th tee, as you can see our great damming efforts have created a large lake. Equipment was sent into lake to pump out the water. Water was pumped out that was 12th tee area. Do you know the as built plans, the hill? It went down that hill. During the process, you have pictures of the wall being reinforced with gravel, sand and the liners with the wall that you see here. Then you had areas with a great deal of filtering and sand bagging, and also with the hay bales. When you look at the opposite side, the water going away looks pretty clear. There is a little silt, but some of the pictures show the water is much better than what we have seen in the past.
David: How are the hay bales on 3rd pond?
Bob: They are gone. I just heard that last night.
David: I heard that a few days ago, and frankly I find it a bit offensive that the people from the city who were supposed to report things like this didn't bother doing it.
Bob: The 300 ft. hill is still there. I was expecting to see this hill down, but when I did approach to get over the hill, this is what you saw with the hay bales and the lake on the
12th tee, and the other areas you see here. This was taken at about 5:30 p.m You may have read in the paper what has happened with the Mt. Hood situation.
David: What has happened?
Bob: Rick Amirault has resigned. There is an independent audit going on for the Mt. Hood area for determining just where the money is.
David: I did hear that there is supposedly 70 cents a ton that has been paid for and no one can account where it has been deposited. I don't know if that is true or not, but someone did tell me that.
Bob: I think it is just lost in the conquers of city government. It is probably in some account, but that is what the auditors are trying to find out. It is none of our business at this point. There is a whole group of people who will be working on aspects of the project at this time. My main concern at the meeting last night is basically the term closure, stopping the project, and with enforcement act orders that are out against the Parks Dept., that is pretty hard for this to stop, especially with all that clay that is sitting up there, and the 300 ft. and this new 200 ft. hill that is sitting at the other end of the area. From what I got out if, it is going to be stabilizing the sight so it is to protect the wetland resource areas from any additional impact, complete and maintain drainage controls so as to minimize runoff impacts and to further extend protected wetland's resource area to restore disturbed wetland resource areas in accordance with the con com's enforcement order and to continue to submit reports to the conservation commission was required under the enforcement order. I have no inspection reports this evening. With all the turmoil that is going on within the Parks Dept and City Hall, it is probably sitting on someone's desk at this time.
David: After our last meeting Bob called me and asked me to go and inspect because they had put the wall in and wanted to start filling behind the wall, and a couple of things I observed that were quite interesting was first that where the wall was there is hay bales, the hay bales had snow on them and the reports we got at least led me to believe that somebody was checking those hay bales every day, but there is only one set of footprints on snow that had been there for two weeks. I added a second set of footprints and you couldn't inspect them from the upland side of it because there was the wall, the soil was too soft, you couldn't walk on the side, there were no footprints in the snow there anyway. I was curious how someone could be checking to make sure the hay bales were intact if you couldn't see them without walking on them. The second thing I observed and I suggested Bob tell you about was that I thought they extended the pipe well beyond what you told them they could do in terms of getting quotes to the easterly wetland, and also what I observed was they had started building the wall along the easterly wetland when I think we had explicitly told them not to do any work there until we came and expected the other parts.
Paul: I think we told them that they can build the walls.
David: Both walls at both ends of the fairway?
Paul: Yes.
David: Okay.
Bob: When I went out for those pictures, Wetland 3 at the far end of the fairway was completed. Those are the pictures that you see at that end, and the next wall at the second wetland area was about ¼ to ½ way, and at that stage the water was just inundating everything and they were pumping more water out afterwards. Once that water was finished, or out, it completed the walls with the same characteristics as the first wall.
David: I was a bit surprised when I looked at the wall they had built because every single time someone sat in front of us or stood over there, they said it was a stonewall, and this was not a stonewall, it was a very large concrete box, about 3 ft. high and about 3 ft. wide and about 10 ft. long.
Bob: But I did mention a couple of meetings ago that the scenario for the stonewall had changed into this Lego type blocks of the sizes, so they did inform me and I did inform the commission that they had changed because the height was increased at that point.
David: But this was after they decreased it, I mean they decreased the height of the wall. When they had the higher wall it was a stonewall, and then they decreased it. It makes sense from a cost prospective the way they were doing it, because it was going to cost them simply less to put these in place than it would have to be build a real stonewall.
Bob: Just like Lego blocks.
David: Yes, because they are blocks with a triangle shape groove on the bottom and a pyramid kind of thing on the top to stabilize them, and they have a hook and that way you just drop it on.
Bob: Right now, we have someone here who wants to talk about the particular subject.
Voted: to open the meeting to the public.
Kenny Foss, 50 Temple Street: I was up at Mt. Hood today with Alderman Spencer, and we drew a lot of people. We had the EML, the contractor for Mt. Hood and for the Parks, and Gator Hood's principals Chuck and Jason Madden showed up and we had quite a discussion. What I found out was that there is migration now into 2nd pond, and at the outflow there were two white perch fish laying flat, bellied up if you will, and also I can see a tint of discoloration flowing into 1st pond, and when I was up on the 12th fairway, Mr. Madden was telling me that they have a problem with the drain pipe because it is resting on peat on the 12th fairway, and hydraulics he said because of the piles (I don't know whether he is right or wrong) that are up on the hill is creating hydraulic pressure that is moving the pipes, and so we have to load the pipes down to keep them in place, so it looks like a disaster. He said it drains toward Wetland #2. I said no, it has to drain to Wetland #3 because there is the brook from Wetland #3 that goes to Penny Road. I said Wetland #2 is dead-ended and it is accumulating a lot of water in there now. I don't know what you can do about the migration of the silt. I spoke to the greens keeper and he said I am going to have a problem, because the pump is going to foul up my irrigation, plus it is going to kill the grass. I am not an engineer, I don't claim to be, but I don't know what you can do about it.
David: He does have a significant problem because at this point and time they have a 16 hole golf course with a good number of the holes isolated that you can't get from 10 to 13 now.
Mr. Foss: Well, they are going to build another pathway.
David: I know, but if they wanted to open, provided they could dry it out, they couldn't even open the back 9 at this time because of the way this has been handled.
Mr. Foss: That is right. They have to build another pathway to the 13th, bypass the 12th from the 11th.
David: I am not sure they can open the 11th because of the problems with the pipe.
Bob: Let's continue with the 12th tee. Anything else, sir?
Mr. Foss: The last time I was here I made mention of flaring out the 11th, and I am saying it has been done. There is loam on it. They are hauling loam in from Lexington and big earth movers and all kinds of equipment up there.
David: Have they replaced the hay bales where the water goes down into 3rd pond now, or is the water just coming straight down there?
Mr. Foss: It is coming straight down. There are some bales of hay there, and as I say it is already into 2nd pond, and it is showing up now in the brook that goes under the road into 1st pond. I can look down and Paul Spencer can verify that too. Thank you.
Voted: to close public participation.
Granite & Burnett Streets
Bob: We have a request for Certificate for Compliance at Granite and Burnett Streets. This is from Elizabeth at DEP, Wetland Sections, through James Sprague, Wetland Section Chief. "The project involved in the construction of a two family, single family residential dwelling, File #217-103, Lot A and Lot B at the corner of Granite & Burnett Streets in Melrose. Compensatory storage for flood plain filing was required in the SLC, which was issued on 9/10/97. Approval on an insignificant plan change to incorporate independent compensatory flood storage on Lot B so that it could be developed as a stand alone project was issued by the department on 6/21/99. This request for Certificate of Compliance is accompanied by as built plan of the site demonstrating adequate compensatory storage for Lot B and was provided. Department staff inspected the site and found that the as built plan accurately represents existing conditions. Lot A has never been developed and SLC has expired with no request for extension. Therefore as a conclusion of this part of this activity has been satisfactorily completed on Lot B, now 88 Granite Street. Activity on Lot A is no longer permitted and then a Certificate of Compliance for the entire site, which should be issued stipulating that the work was never performed on Lot A. A Certificate of Compliance is hereby certified that only the following portions of the work regulated by the above referenced Order of Conditions has been satisfactorily completed. Work has been satisfactory completed on Lot B now 88 Granite Street."
Bob: They have their Order of Conditions.
David: This brought up another site that we need to look at a date on, and that is the Anderson site on Penny Road. We granted them a one-year extension, approximately one year ago.
Bob: I have been told, but it is not verified at this point, that the company went bankrupt.
David: Based on what I have seen there, nothing has happened and a good 8 or more months.
Bob: We will check the files on that and see what the status is and send the notice to the individual that there is no extension at this point.
David: That is one of the things that we discussed last time too, that we give them another year, but they would have to come file again.
Bob: Has everyone seen Slayton Road pictures?
David: Is there a site walk scheduled?
Bob: When it is dry enough. Right now they are supposed to be taking samples of the road and the road is basically under water at this point.
David: It is just amazing how nature has this ability to offer this, like Burnett Street, when we heard it never flowed over the road, boom, before we finished we had that storm, and we did all the calculations, and here at Slayton Road right in the middle of when we are looking at it, we get it again.
Correspondence
Commonwealth of Massachusetts, Executive Office of Environmental Affairs:
From Bob Durand "Dear Friend of the Environment: I am writing to invite you to a special unveiling of a new report from the Executive Office of Environmental Affairs entitled 'The State of Our Environment Update 2001'. In celebration of our new expanded partnership with the University of Massachusetts, the event will be held on Tuesday, 4/10 at 2:30 p.m. at the University of MA at Lowell, in Alumni Hall, North Campus, Lowell.
It is hard to believe that it has been two years since Governor Paul Cellucci and Lt. Governor Jane Swift appointed me Secretary of Environmental Affairs. We have made tremendous progress over the past two years, including: the passage of the Community Preservation Act........"
Bob: This is basically a get together and the letter gives directions on where to go. I will pass this letter around.
Friends of the Middlesex Fells Reservation
They are having their annual meeting, Tuesday, May 8, 7 - 9 p.m. This will beheld at the Botume House Visitors Center at 4 Woodland Road in Stoneham. The topic for the night is Dragonflies and Damselflies. They also have their schedule included in their correspondence and information was passed around to the commissioners.
Summary of the Ell Pond Improvement Council, Inc. Annual Meeting
Dave Dickerson made a motion that members of the Board of Directors and Officers retain their positions for another year, pending concurrence by those officers not present. The committee approved this motion. Dave reported that, at this time, the committee presently has cash holdings of $8,095. The committee agreed to use a portion of this money for water quality monitoring and a portion to purchase additional Ell Pond T-shirts.
Ask Elly:
The committee discussed dates the "Ask Elly" Q + A piece which will appear regularly in the Melrose Free Press and will approach specific topics about the pond and surrounding watershed. The committee agreed that the format would include a turtle logo, and Ainsley Donaldson offered to locate a catchy logo style. Dave Dickerson will use his home address for correspondence with the public.
2001 Festival:
The committee discussed dates for the 2001 Festival. The MDC generator and stage are tentatively available June 2, and the man who controls the sound is definitely available for that date. Ainsley will ask Remax if the hot-air balloon will be available for use at the festival. June 16th will serve as a backup date if the balloon is not available for the 2nd.
The Bugaloo Swamis are interested in performing at the festival again.
The Knoll:
The City of Melrose must submit the application for this year's Historic Landscape Grant for the improvements to the knoll area, which is not registered as a historic site. The application is due in May. The grant money would be used to properly survey the site to prepare to register it.
Other Business:
The committee discussed the need to repair the footbridge and have it re-installed. Dave will write a letter to Melrose High School Principal Dan Burke asking if students would be available to fix the bridge on-site. Ainsley will follow up with a phone call to Mr. Burke.
Dana Jewell offered to lead a bird watching expedition around the pond. A date has not yet been set.
Next meeting will be April 4 at 7 p.m. at the Milano Senior Center.
Massachusetts Urban Forestry Program
A note was received showing all the different type of groups located in MA that are in the Heralding the Heritage Trees; they are getting grants to put trees in the community. Information with a listing was passed around.
Commonwealth of MA, Executive Office of Environmental Affairs
Re: The Urban Conservation Commission Network
CZM, MBP and DEP want to provide you continuous technical assistance for your priority issues and concerns. In additions, we want state staff to be available to you on a monthly basis to answer your important regulatory questions. Therefore, our agencies are working together to launch the Urban Conservation Commission Network. This regional network is based upon the success of the North Shore Conservation Commission Network, which meets the first Thursday of each month for topic specific technical assistance, information sharing, and regulatory questions and answers. There are nearly thirty towns in that network currently. How, we would like to begin this new network to focus on the issues and topics that most concern urban municipalities.
The first meeting will be held on Wednesday, April 18, from 12:30 - 3:00 p.m. at the Bunker Hill Community College, Room B215. Jan Smith, MBP Director, will be made a presentation on EPA Phase II storm water management regulations that impact your community. At this meeting we would like to hear about topics you would like to discuss in the future. We will obtain the technical expertise you need and organize the presentations for future meetings. These meetings will be informal, relaxed and offer plenty of time for round table, interactive discussions and questions. We will also discuss a regular meeting date, time and location for your convenience.
Invoices
Bob: I have two bills for photo work and for books that were read at the Read Day at the public schools. They total approximately $120.
Voted: to pay these invoices.
8 Hemenway Ave. - Steve Amero
Bob: We also received from DEP Notification Wetlands Protection Acts File # Melrose 2170120. The applicant is Steve Amero and this is for a home at 8 Hemenway Ave. and tonight we are looking at it to determine the Order of Conditions. You also have in front of you the map that was submitted to us indicating additional hay bales along the roadway as directed by the commission, and also the correspondence received from DEP.
I will pass out the boilerplates and I will use one as the standard document for our secretary who is not present tonight. We will add on the options.
The commission compiled the Order of Conditions for 8 Hemenway Ave.
Voted: to accept the Order of Conditions based on the Boiler Plate and Additional Conditions that were outlined.
Steven Amero: Is there an appeal period that someone can appeal this, and has it passed or does it start from today?
Bob: It is a 21 day appeal from date of issue and you will receive it by Certified Letter, which will be probably in about a week.
Mr. Amero: Does the Building Inspector get a copy of this or do I have to give him a copy?
Bob: The Building Inspector and the Engineering Dept. will be receiving a copy.
Mr. Amero: Do I take the copy that I get and go down to the Registry of Deeds?
Bob: You will have the paperwork, they will certify it, stamp it, and you send us back a copy with a stamp on it that it was registered.
Mr. Amero: Do I wait until the 3 week period and then register it or can I register it right away?
Bob: You can register it right away, but if there is an appeal and during the appeal process there is change, then you would have to re-register it.
Mr. Amero: The only problem would be that I would have to register it twice. Once I receive this I could actually start the process, getting a building permit, etc.
Bob: You can move through the other city departments to approve your plans, get their comments, the planning board, etc. They will be looking for our acceptance to the project.
Bill: I believe it is 10 days from the date of issuance, not 21 days. You may want to check. Typically, 21 days is the date we have to have a hearing after filing a ll, 10 days is the appeals period, but double check that. Secondly, if you record the Order of Conditions, that is for the purpose commencing your work. Your appeal period is entirely separate from having to report. You can't start your work unless you report.
820 & 828 Lynn Fells Parkway
Bob: Next project is Notice of Intent by John McLaughlin, 820 and 828 Lynn Fells Parkway, Lots 2, 2B, and 4. The applicant proposes to construct a parking lot and perform associated grading activities as shown in the accompanied map. The total area of riverfront area on the side of proposed subject is 27,505 sq. ft. and proposed alteration of the riverfront area is to be just about 3,726 sq. ft.
David: I know you can't answer this, Bob, but I find it interesting that the berm goes through the corner of the building.
Bill: Are these both his buildings, because this is a dentist office over here, right? He signed the application, but he hasn't put his name as an applicant.
Bob: Well the applicant is John McLaughlin.
Bill: If you look at the signature page, it is Mark Gianatassio. That is Mr. Gianatassio's dentist office I think on that side. This is the new building over here, right?
Bob: The existing one story brick building. There is a pumping station there.
David: There is a pumping station the next lot over based on the abutter's list.
Bob: Is this the lot he came in with before?
David: This is the one he came in with before right here, and I don't know what is here, but the next one is the pumping station, and I think right past that used to be the Grimmo property that we dealt with a few years ago.
Paul: So is the existing one story building, the one that had the two story building?
David: Yes. I think so.
Bill: I am trying to recall. Is McLaughlin to the left and the dentist on the right, or have I got it switched around?
David: I think this is McLaughlin based on what I remember. That is the footprint they were doing when they added a second story. The dentist building is indicated right past it.
Paul: So we already have a couple of problems with plans?
Bill: If you look at the signature on page 7, the owner is different than the applicant, and the owner is different than McLaughlin, so I don't if he is buying it off him. Before he does he wants to get this squared away.
Bob: It says property owner, if different from applicant. I don't know what that means.
Bill: The thing is I forget which building is for whom. Whatever building he came for a year or two ago is two stories, isn't it?
David: Yes. They probably took the old plan.
Bill: It looks great, but if he doesn't own both partials and we issue an order, the order always says the applicant or successors, and if Gianatassio owns something and he is going to continue to own, this isn't like a precondition to a sale of the building to McLaughlin. It is possible the successor to the lot, Gianatassio, wants to be selling, and it wouldn't be effective because he hasn't really put his name on here as a filer. The lawyer wouldn't know how to touch him sincerely. They might hold McLaughlin liable.
David: I can answer your question when I see on the transmittal form that it says property owner, if different see attached list of abutters, and the list of abutters for 820, which is where this work is being done, is Gianatassio.
Bill: So he is on the left then. But Gianatassio signed the petition as the owner, not McLaughlin. McLaughlin's name is the applicant. Nobody is listed as the owner.
David: Actually it does say the property owner referred to on the attached list of abutters, and the abutter does list it.
Bill: As one of many abutters, right? DMD signs it as the owner. This is a minor point. It has nothing to do with the quality of the project. When I looked at it, the parking lot is going to start here and they both are going to have the advantage of it I think, but at least Gianatassio signed it, but typically you have the applicant sign if they are doing something for owner, the owner is also listed, or the applicant is trying to get something done as a precondition to buying the lot on which the work will be done.
Bob: So there should only be one signature, signature of applicant and property owner should be the same.
Bill: No, McLaughlin owns the property he is on, so they should both sign as the owners.
Looking here though, maybe it is the only McLaughlin piece of work that is going to effect the research area?
David: I would consider both are all in the riverfront. Something we will want clarified is I know that there is flood plain in this area. I don't know whether this resides on the inside or outside, but it doesn't mention it at all in here the proximity to a flood plain.
Bob: We ran through that before with the other lot, and I think the flood plain just reached the edge, just sort of skimmed the property.
David: We did this one. I think we dealt with it because it was in the flood plain. I think when we dealt with this it was before we were really applying riverfront 2A. So if this is in a flood plain at 67.5 ft., and the lot is 66.69 ft. and 63.8 and 65.2, then that is flood plain and I think they do address it in terms of further on.
Bob: We can bring those up at the next meeting which will be involved with the particular project. I will set the hearing for the next meeting at 7:45 p.m.
Bill: Isn't there something after he put the building up or fixed it that you had an issue with? On the insurance building the drain system wasn't as promised or something?
David: I think the whole footprint was different.
Bob: When they opened up the building they found quite a bit of rot, insect damage, so they took the whole building down and put up a new one, same footprint.
Main St., Adjacent to the Metropolitan Commission Drainage Canal
Bob: In this particular project there will be two members who will not be participating. This is for property located at Main St. adjacent to the Metropolitan Commission Drainage Canal, but talking to Mr. Joseph Freeman with ERB Tech, the engineering firm that is putting this project together, he is agreed because of two commissioners who will not be participating and because of other commissioners who will be traveling at the next meetings to agree to the second meeting in May, so this particular project will be heard at that time. This will be a request for Determination of Applicability, giving them an extra 30 days, will give a chance for the architects to work on the site and may give us a better idea of what they are intending to do. The two commissioners are not required to be here for that particular session, but they are welcome to remove themselves from the table and sit in the audience if they are interested in doing that.
David: The recommendation from the state at the caucus was it is best to entirely vacate the premises so with that said, I request if there are any other business or any other public participation of hearings that they could be scheduled before this so myself and the other commissioner in question could participate up to that point and then leave the meeting for the evening.
Bob: That is what we will be doing. Right now we have a scheduled meeting for Slayton Road, tentatively during that time period, but that is not confirmed at this time. I will not be here at the next meeting and I will not be at the first week in May. We have Paul Locke who will be taking over the chairmanship for those meetings and will be conducting a hearing for this particular group on the Parkway and the other members who will be participating also. Make sure you bring your packages with you, and you have new updates to the handbook for Conservation Commissioners. Are there any other questions?
Mt. Hood - 12 Fairway
David: Right now they have stopped all work, other than stabilizing and doing mitigation at Mt. Hood?
Bob: Regarding the Mt. Hood situation as of last night, they were still receiving fill.
Paul: I thought that was supposed to end in March?
Bob: So did I, but we were informed last night that the availability of fill was still available, and they continued to receive material as of yesterday. Like the gentleman was saying here before, loam coming from Lexington is being put onto the field . There is a lot of heavy equipment on site, moving stuff around and there is a bit rush to get the fields out there by June 1.
David: Are they doing any work on the 12th fairway or anything close to the resource area?
Bob: The area on the12th fairway, from my understanding, is that the drainage is completed and there is some back filling going on near the completed walls, and they are also trying to stabilize the draining system to get it into the ground because there is so much water. The site that I saw in the completion that you see in the photos looks just the way they were projecting it for, it is not the stonewall, but it is basically the impression that they are not going to do any more than what you see there. I guess that one was just about 4 or 5 ft. off the ground at the 3rd wetland area, and the other one looked about twice that height. The filling was not accepted at that point because it wasn't completed, but that particular area that you are looking at is completed. That is where it stands. Everything is supposed to be stopped up there. The only problem we had is the term closure and completely stopped, that is the problem I have at Mt. Hood and they were moving that term around last night. It cannot stop completely. They will have to stabilize certain areas just for the safety of everyone involved here. The 300 ft. mound of dirt that is up there could slide away very easily, it depends the type of storm you get. The second hill also could go very quickly.
David: Quite frankly, I am a bit offended that they didn't comply with our allowing them work by giving us a written update of the work there, which was supposed to happen. As far as I know no one on this commission received any notification about the breach and hay bales that were protecting 3rd pond. I found out about it from a member of the public and an alderman, but one of the things I think they are required to do is when they have a problem like that, tell us.
Bob: That is correct. I didn't receive any calls from Joe Lynch or anyone else.
David: The result is who is now responsible for the work up there as the result of Rich Amirault resigning?
Bob: Right now, the responsibility of the work has fallen into the engineering department which Joe Lynch is responsible. He would be assigning one of the engineers, probably John, to monitor the sites at this point. There is an active participation of looking for a replacement for Mr. Amirault that is going on, but I don't expect that to be completed for at least 4-6 weeks. There will be probably be a temporary part-time superintendent put in place. I don't know who that will be at this time.
David: Paul, at the last inspection which you did, I know the southerly ILSF that is up against the Trimount side of it, the stuff we had asked them to do cascading hay bales hadn't been done. I didn't get there last time I went. It was difficult enough getting from where I started to where I was back again. I wasn't climbing another mountain. Did you go up to there and see if they have done it?
Bob: The last time I saw that particular area, the clay had gone over the hay bales and in the pond itself, or in that wetland area. That was a good month and one-half ago. Like we are saying, this stuff is just like quick sand and I wasn't going to be tromping through that area because I was working at the other end of the 12th tee, that is the side I came in from. The aspect of Penny Road of the 13th tee going around, we took a tour of the area on that particular day and the water coming off the hill was crystal clear, so the silt wasn't breaching the barriers.
David: That is good, because it was the last time I inspected it.
Bob: At the 12th tee, there was a question that you mentioned about the water holding stain in that area and then going over around to the 13th tee, the water was so heavy, the water was backing up in the rear and going over the hill and coming in on the 13th tee from the opposite side, so you had both waters coming around to the 13th tee and going over, there is some connection between the 12th and the 13th in the 2nd wetland area because you could see the water coming down between two hills.
David: So right now they are not doing any more filling or work on the 12th fairway. Is that totally stopped before they come before us again?
Bob: I cannot say it has totally stopped because as of last night they were still receiving it.
David: They weren't putting it into the 12th fairway; they were stock piling it on the mounds?
Bob: They can't stock pile it on the 2nd mound, because technically what he is saying they are spreading loam in that 1st area.
Paul: They are supposed to come before us to inspect the walls before they put fill behind the walls.
Bob: I think they used my inspection for that 2nd wall for that filling. If they are filling the 2nd wetland wall area, that was not completed when I was there. The 2nd wall at wetland #3 was completed/installed.
David: If what Mr. Foss said it true, that right now they have got silt that has gone from 3rd pond into 2nd pond, and has now being seen in 1st pond, I don't think they should be doing anything period there other than mitigation of damage. I don't think there should be any filling, any hauling, anything at all, and quite frankly, I know someone like the Mayor is going to make the argument that it is going to cost us a ton of money to stop it, but quite frankly I can go on record to say that they have done this over and over again, have not followed what has been done, and if we stop all the filling there, it is not our fault if the city has to spend a lot of money to do it themselves. It is the Mayor's fault, it is Joe Lynch and the department, the engineering dept., it is the fault of the Parks Department if this was not done correctly.
Bob: First of all we have to get up there to see what is going on at this time, and see all this loam that is going up there. From what they were saying last night, there must be 30 or 40 trucks that have been there this week alone, dumping the stuff, and from my understanding the way Joe Lynch was talking, that we have clay. It sounds like a filter layer is going down on top of that, plus you have a sort of gravel bed put on top of that, plus you have another layer of dirt, and then you have the loam put on top of that which gives you sort of a drainage capability here because with that clay I don't think you can drain, it is not going to go very far, so you are putting layers on top of layers. We are talking only about the ball field area here.
David: At this point and time with both ILSF's breached and damaged, with two wetlands breached and damaged, and one pond breached and damaged, with questions that we had arisen about infiltration all the way down to the wetland on Penny Road, on questions we have had brought up about 2nd pond and potentially 1st pond being damaged, I don't see 1 inch of what they have been doing at this point outside of our jurisdiction, whether it is in a buffer zone or otherwise. I know we have jurisdiction after the fact that they do work upland that damages the resource area, and it is clear that they have done that.
Bob: Well part of the determination that they want to do is to stabilize the site and complete and maintain drainage controls and to restore disturbed wetlands resource in accordance with the con com's enforcement order. They are planning to restore at least the Wetlands 1 and 2.
Paul: Just because they are planning to do restoration, doesn't mean that they should continue now with the work that is continuing to affect those wetlands. Just because you are going to fixing in the end doesn't mean that you can make it as dirty as you want now.
David: If Mr. Foss is correct, if he saw two dead fish and there is a potential fish fill in 2nd pond as a result of the silt from that, we have got a huge and much more devastating issue than we have had up to this point.
Bob: Okay. So what would be the commission's view of doing, talking to Mr. Lynch to bring us up to date on just what is going on, getting a site visit out there and see what is going on, how do you want to handle this?
David: We keep visiting and it keeps getting worse.
Bob: Well our last visit we created the 12th tee lake out of that, and we have so much filtering going on the water looks cleaner than it ever has been in the Wetlands 2 and 3 area.
Paul: It is a lot cleaner than in the last couple of months, but not than it ever has been before.
Bob: That is right, cleaner in the last couple of months.
David: But not cleaner in the 3rd, apparently 2nd pond, which were in far more jeopardy based on what had happened up until now. The 2 wetlands on the 12th fairway, for probably all intents and purposes of hatching out anything, were probably dead until they replicated recovered.
Bob: Wetlands 1 and 2 on the haul road area?
David: No, ILSF 1 and 2, that is correct, based on if there was any activity, for all intense and purposes gone. Probably the same for both wetlands on the 12th fairway. 3rd pond is probably in that area as well for any activity, hatching or otherwise. The 3rd pond, in my mind is a different entity, in that they drain that pond so far down every year anyway, that there is probably no fish or otherwise that live in it. But if Mr. Foss is correct and this is now coming into 2nd pond, then this is continuing to get worse, and I did speak to someone who was up there and observed that the hay bales were entirely knocked out as a result of the 5 in. rain storm, sloping down into 3rd pond, and it is just the pond coming down with no protection. That is something that every Order of Conditions, if there is that kind of breach, we are supposed to be informed. We were supposed to be given inspection reports and we didn't get the inspection reports.
Bob: Tonight we did not get the inspection reports. It is probably sitting on someone's desk.
Paul: Even after the inspection reports, when you have a breach like they still have an obligation to tell us.
David: I make a motion that we Cease and Desist all work at Mt. Hood, ball park, 12th tee area relating to filling, regrading, hauling, and otherwise with the exception of stabilizing any currently in place fill or continuing to perform work that will detect what is left of Wetland 2.
Bob: So you wish to have a motion to Cease and Desist?
David: Yes, all activities, filling, regrading and otherwise, and the exceptions are stabilizing any fill piles that they have, so they don't fall over as a result of the next rainstorm and taking care of and maintaining the barriers and others that are currently in place.
Paul: What he is suggesting, and I am not saying I agree to that, would extend any movement of clay, soil, loam, gravel, anywhere between and including the haul road, across the fields, the 11th fairway.
David: But I am looking at the bigger picture. We will call it the wall of unintended consequences, and what could happen is that someone says now let's just dump all the stuff right off the road that goes between the north and south part and it all ends up in Long Pond next, and I don't want it to say well they can't haul it here, so let's just stockpile it someplace else, and start destroying someplace else. That is why I am saying the entire of Mt. Hood. But no one is going to second it, it doesn't matter.
Bob: We have a motion on the floor to Cease and Desist all activity in the Mt. Hood, ball park and 12th tee area concerning filling, grading and movement of clay or other fill material, but the capability of stabilizing certain areas for public safety.
David: And continue to maintain the protective areas. The way you are phrasing that could cause the problem I am talking about. They will say let's just stockpile it someplace else and we end up with another wetland that is damaged.
Bob: I don't think the stock piling after last night is going to continue. They continued to receive it as of last night, but the impression I got was basically......
Paul: This would also include bringing in any dirt, gravel, loam, any fill material.
Bill: I second the motion.
Bruce: I move that we open it for discussion.
Paul: I don't think we should put out a Cease & Desist Order based on here say.
Bob: I agree with that.
Paul: None of us has been up and viewed the alleged latest transgressions and if, in fact, the material is continuing to impact the wetlands and 3rd pond, then certainly some action will be justified. We can perhaps authorize a group of commissioners to go up and make an inspection, and pending the outcome of that inspection, issue a Cease and Desist Order.
Bruce: I think it might be a good idea to bring in one of the wetlands guys so he can bring in an official report.
Bob: Are you talking DEP?
Bruce: One of the consultants or DEP.
Bob: A consultant will take too long after last night's contract discussion.
Paul: It is not a question now of how much the wetlands have been damaged; it is a question whether they are continuing to be damaged.
David: There is a question regarding 2nd pond that as far as we know had not been damaged, and there is a question that now it may be. You are right, we can make a case, but maybe we shouldn't do this until we have first hand observation, but we do have a first hand observation that they have not complied with the partial lifting of it because they did not give us the records of the inspections.
Bruce: Well the motion that you gave, Dave, said it tells you what you don't want them to do. It doesn't tell them why you don't want them to do it and I think that is the part that is missing from the motion, and I also agree that we can't make a decision on second hand information and hear say. Is there a way that we can get DEP to come down and let us know what is going on and what their recommendation would be?
Bob: Do we want DEP in here first or do we want to get out there and look at it and see what is going on?
Paul: Ideally, we could go out there with them.
Bill: Maybe you could find out if there is a report sitting on somebody's desk that otherwise would have been here tonight.
David: I don't know how the rest of you feel, but I think this scope of what has gone on and the damage that has done has gone beyond my ability personally, or my technical knowledge and otherwise to deal with at this point and time. II think we need DEP involved in it.
Bruce: If it is intruding from one pond into another, how long before it would effect 1st pond, and Long Pond.
David: Mr. Foss did say he saw the coloring in 1st pond.
Bob: Would Circuit Rider be the individual?
Bruce: Yes.
David: If this motion fails, I have another one.
Bob: I can contact a Circuit Rider in the Wilmington Office and see if he/she is available and if they are available on the weekends.
David: Do they have the authority to stop work if what they see is too outlandish?
Bob: Yes
David: If they can do that, I would withdraw the motion.
Bob: First of all I don't know if they are available for the weekend, but I am assuming they probably are. Next determination would be when are they available during the weekend and who would go with them to the site. Who wants to go?
Bill: Isn't their authority also on the Statue of Regulations for a commissioner about to issue a Cease & Desist Order?
Bob: That is correct. That is what Paul was saying that upon observation of what is going on.....
Bill: David, I thought you had been up there and seen some of that stuff. I know the hay bales, but.....
David: The last time I went up they had reached a certain amount of work that Paul had agreed they could do and Bob asked me to go up and inspect it, and I came back and said to Bob that based on what I saw I was comfortable saying go ahead. But that only dealt with the work directly on the 12th fairway and adding additional hay bales and otherwise to the ILSF. It didn't deal with additional stock piling and other work that they are currently doing.
Bob: But any commissioner can issue a Cease & Desist Order. Who is willing to go with a Circuit Rider for the walk this weekend?
Bruce: If it is Saturday afternoon, then I could go.
Bill: I am available Monday during the day.
David: Indefinite. Call me when you find out when they can come.
Bob: I will give the Circuit Rider a call tomorrow and then I will get back to one of you to make a decision, and upon the site visit with the Circuit Rider, any commissioner has the right to issue a Cease & Desist Order for the city to come in and make a discussion.
David: I would like to make an additional motion. That we hire, or otherwise do what is necessary to do water quality sampling at the entrance to 2nd pond at the outlet to 2nd pond, at the entrance to 1st pond, and the outlet to 1st pond, and that said sampling be for clay and other particular matters that could be related to construction activities. We know it is in 3rd pond, but is it getting into 2nd, is it getting out of 2nd, is it getting into 1st and is it getting out of 1st, and if it is getting out of 1st, I would suggest that we go all the way downstream as well, and see if it has gone as far down as Towners, the entrance formed there. When I was up there with former Alderman Benezra, we looked at the stream from 2nd to 1st pond, and there was color in the leaves that looked like a similar color to the clay mat. If you picked up the leaves and disturbed it, it wasn't sediment on it, it was just the color of the leaf and that stated the compensation. So just observing that color in the water doesn't necessarily mean that there is a penetration into area. If we do water sampling, then it becomes more than observational, and clearly you can show whether or not the damage is being done and also it tells the level of it. An expert who does this ought to be able to tell us if it has reached a level where they can effect any aquatic life.
Paul: There are standards for total suspended solids.
David: I would like to make that a motion for testing of the waters at those four points.
Bill: Do we have funding for that?
Bob: Yes we do, and the concept is that since this is being caused by this situation, I would probably refer the funding back to the Parks or to the City.
Bill: If it turns out it is causing a problem, do we have funding to cover that kind of sampling in the budget.
Bob: Yes, under maintenance.
Voted: To have the waters tested at the above stated four points.
Bruce: How would a commissioner in DEP go on a site visit with DEP effect it? I can understand why David and I can't sit in here when Pembroke comes in here, but why on a site visit when you are both acting in the capacities of a responsible party, where you are going out there and you just want to make sure people are performing what they need to do? You are not influencing DEP's decision by being in DEP, are you?
Bob: Maybe I will turn that over to the lawyer in view of trying this case. Would you find that as a conflict to DEP employees going with a DEP representative?
Paul: It would be representing the City of Melrose to the DEP and that would be a conflict of interest.
David: As a non-lawyer, I can see a distinct conflict of interest if you worked in the area of DEP that was being asked you to do this, but in duty of this agency as a whole? Could you exercise undue influences in result of prior relationships?
Paul: Possibly
David: We could do that as well because we got to know these people through social interactions and otherwise.
Bob: But you see them maybe twice a year, we see them on a day-by-day basis.
David: There would be no conflict for me as a Conservation Commissioner, if the Circuit
Rider happened to be a personal friend, there is no legal means, but in this case there is a middle connection.
Bob: That is correct.
Voted: to adjourn at 9:30 p.m.
Respectfully submitted,
Nancy Pritchard
Secretary